Received: by dot.crosswinds.net (mbox republican) (with Cubic Circle's cucipop (v1.31 1998/05/13) Mon Nov 1 17:44:22 1999) X-From_: owner-cdn-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Sun Oct 31 22:46:11 1999 Return-Path: Received: from broadway.sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca (majordomo@broadway.sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca [198.169.128.1]) by dot.crosswinds.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA64147 for ; Sun, 31 Oct 1999 22:46:09 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from owner-cdn-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca) Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by broadway.sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca (8.8.8/8.8.8) id TAA27698; Sun, 31 Oct 1999 19:10:39 -0600 Date: Sun, 31 Oct 1999 19:10:39 -0600 Message-Id: <199911010110.TAA27698@broadway.sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca> X-Authentication-Warning: broadway.sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca: majordomo set sender to owner-cdn-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca using -f From: owner-cdn-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca (Cdn-Firearms Digest) To: cdn-firearms-digest@broadway.sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Subject: Cdn-Firearms Digest V3 #189 Reply-To: cdn-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Sender: owner-cdn-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Errors-To: owner-cdn-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Precedence: normal Cdn-Firearms Digest Sunday, October 31 1999 Volume 03 : Number 189 In this issue: bear update Re: cc s337 in practice Re: contacts numbers To all members of the recreational firearm community: Re: reregistration?? Registration under Amnesty lieberal thought for today Buying Gun Stuff In The US Locations of Shooting Ranges in BC Re: Cdn-Firearms Digest V3 #188 Request for action Re: posting! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 06:51:48 -0600 From: OFAH@oncomdis.on.ca (Mark Holmes) Subject: bear update OFAH FILE: 405 legal October 27, 1999 For Immediate Release To Selected Media O.F.A.H. constitutional court case remains strong Despite the withdrawal of a partnering organization, the Ontario Federation of Anglers and Hunters (O.F.A.H.) remains highly optimistic en route to court hearings to prove, once and for all, that hunting is a right, not just a privilege in Canada. This week's announcement that the Northern Ontario Tourist Outfitters (N.O.T.O.) is withdrawing from the high profile constititutional court case was disappointing, but in no way jeopardizes the O.F.A.H.'s chances of winning, declared Rick Morgan, O.F.A.H. Executive Vice President. "We (the O.F.A.H.) felt that N.O.T.O. could have brought an important perspective to our case. However, now it will be up to the O.F.A.H. to represent the interests of the outfitters, guides and lodging businesses as well as average hunters, anglers and trappers," Morgan said. The withdrawal from the consitutional challenge also indicates that N.O.T.O believes the O.F.A.H. can win this case on its own, added Morgan who noted that N.O.T.O. now gets the best of both worlds. "Now N.O.T.O. can pursue the government (of Ontario) for financial compensation for its members and then sit back and wait for us to win the right to hunt. Winning the right to hunt should, ultimately, lead to the return of the spring bear hunt, but, now, the O.F.A.H. must bear 100 percent of the cost and workload" Morgan explained. The loss of the spring hunt left many tourist operators facing bankruptcy, and negotiations between N.O.T.O. and the government for financial compensation were frozen when the court case was jointly launched by the two organizations. The Government of Ontario announced the impending closure of the spring hunt last January, and, despite overwhelming public support for continuing the hunt, formally cancelled the event last spring. The O.F.A.H. went to court in April to get an injunction against cancellation of the spring hunt and to determine if there was sufficient evidence to warrant a constitutional challenge. Although Justice Irwin Stach declined to grant an injunction, he clearly stated there were grounds to proceed to a more senior court where constitutional arguments on the government's bear hunt decision could be heard. The O.F.A.H. is Ontario's largest, nongovernment, conservation organization with close to 81,000 Individual Members and 610 Member Clubs. - -30- For more information about this issue, please contact O.F.A.H. Communications Specialist Mark Holmes at 705-748-6324, fax to 705-748-9577, or e-mail ofah@ofah.org ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 Oct 1999 19:05:43 -0600 From: Myles Bruns Subject: Re: cc s337 in practice I would like to let you know that reciting cc s337, 494, etc. is not always successful in getting the police, etc. to release one's property. I know of two instances here in Kamloops where items were seized and a judge ordered the release of those items but the RCMP refused to do so. When the relevant sections of the cc were mentioned the police just shrugged and said "so... ?" When queried, the RCMP members commented that no one in the detachment would effect an arrest, and the crown was very unlikely to lay charges. So they were not swayed by this tactic. Give it a try, but your mileage may vary. Myles ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 Oct 1999 19:06:11 -0600 From: "John Perocchio" Subject: Re: contacts numbers Dear Cathy, Many thanks for forwarding the list in question. Please rest assured that Y105 FM's many listeners in the firearms community appreciate your predicament and your efforts to correct this incredably ill-advised & misworded spousal abuse ad. I will send the information you've been kind enough to furnish to all those that have been active in our endeavour to correct this ad's discrimination against firearms owners. I have also forwarded the CPFO's comments about firearms use in spousal abuse for comment & clarification to our national & provincial firearms groups. Sincerely, John Perocchio - -----Original Message----- From: Cathy Pendrith To: 'John Perocchio' Date: October 31, 1999 1:09 PM Subject: contacts numbers > > >Hello Mr. Perocchio. > >Regarding the "firearms" line in the Crimestoppers ad, I discovered that it >was added to the commercial at the request of the Chief Firearms Officer of >Ontario. I contacted him to bring your concern to his attention. He told >me that his office "Fully supports the legal use of firearms", it's those >who use them illegally his office has a problem with. I was actually under >the impression that very few domestic abuse incidents involved firearms. I >was told that I was mistaken. In fact, over 3,000 of the over 18 thousand >spousal assaults in Ontario last year involved firearms. That being said it >definitely was not the intent of the Chief Firearms Office to vilify law >abiding gun owners. > >I was given the following contacts. > >CRIMESTOPPERS: Alex Williamson 705-329-6147 > >And the Communications Branch of The Office Of The Solicitor General >416-326-5004 > >I hope those numbers help. > >I realize this is a very sensitive issue, and am working toward finding a >solution that will satisfy all parties involved. > >I will keep you informed. > >Sincerely, > >Cathy Pendrith > ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 Oct 1999 19:06:17 -0600 From: CILA / ICAL Subject: To all members of the recreational firearm community: CILA / ICAL Defending Canada's Heritage - -------------------------------------------- October 31st, 1999 To all members of the recreational firearm community: Since the passing of Bill C-68 we have changed. Our community, which consists of the nicest, most generous human beings I have ever had the pleasure of sharing company with, has mutated. Once we prided ourselves on our contributions to our local communities and charitable projects abounded, but as of the onset of the federal government's assault on us, we had to look inward to protect ourselves. We rolled the wagon's into a circle and forgot what kind of people we really were. But my eyes were reopened this past month. I met Dakotah Lynne Van Veen. She is two and a half years old and has Cerebral Palsy. This beautiful child was born on June 6, 1997, at the Greater Niagara General Hospital in Niagara Falls, Ontario. It was a very complicated delivery and they had to use forceps to assist her birth. On her fourth day, for reasons unknown, she stopped breathing. Upon discovery of her lifeless body, a nurse rushed her immediately to the nursery where she was resuscitated and transferred later that night to McMaster's Children's Hospital in Hamilton. She stayed there for a month in the Neonatal Intensive Care Unit where she was able to recuperate. They did several tests, all of which were inconclusive. Upon release, her doctors gave her parents very little hope for her future and told them that she would be handicapped, both mentally and physically, with little chance for a normal life. But they were wrong Her therapists now say she is somewhat "mentally age appropriate". Unfortunately, she is trapped in a body that just won't work for her. She gets bored and frustrated. Her mother, Linda, is unable to work because of Dakotah's many appointments at the Niagara Peninsula Children's Centre. Her dad, Kevin, drives a truck and works as many hours as he can get to try to improve life for his beloved daughter. Her parents are trying to do everything they can to help improve her quality of life. But guess what! Our rotten stinking government only provides enough to barely maintain her current level of medical care. The government is unwilling to explore any of the proven alternatives that have had great successes with disabled children. With all the equipment she requires and the extra therapy she needs, the financial burden on her family is tremendous. And while the federal government has billions to spend on gun registration, they have no money to improve the quality of life for one, very small, little girl. Currently she is receiving an extra hour of physiotherapy ( she really needs more) per week at a cost of $75.00 per session. She is also receiving an hour of Feldenkrais therapy per week at a cost of $60.00 per session. She has made some extremely positive gains with this type of therapy and it must be continued. For instance, it helped her discover her fingers individually and she isn't forced to keep her hands clenched in a fist anymore (a very painful experience). A promising alternative that needs to be explored is the "Conductive Education at Ability Camp". The Camp costs approximately $4,000.00 for a 5 week session. There is also Hyperbaric Oxygen Treatments with 40 treatments at a cost of $75.00 per treatment. TASC (Therapy and Alternatives for Special Children) usually run two therapy camps in the summer with approximate cost of $1,000.00 each. The Van Veen family are currently trying to buy a Pony Walker that will help Dakotah with some independent mobility, but they are over $2,000.00 and guess what; the government only covers part of cost. Little Dakotah has also had tremendous relief from the injection of Botulism Toxin directly into her muscle groups...but at a cost of $400.00 per cc! But at least there is hope. While Dakotah is a happy child and gets a lot of love and assistance from her family, she could make much more progress if her family had the resources to pay for the treatments our government refuses to give. I am writing this letter to ask for your help. CILA has set up "The Dakotah Fund: Aiming for the Heart." This charitable fund will be overseen by the Board of Directors of the Ontario Handgun Association and this will assist little Dakotah by providing the medical services she needs to truly make a difference in the quality of her life. Any surplus moneys will be used to help other children to get the treatment they need; treatments that our miserable excuse for a government says are "not necessary". I would like to kick off this project by personally donating $50 to the Dakotah Fund and issuing this challenge: Match me! (or better me). Show the world what the firearms community is really made of and make a real difference in the life of one little girl (or if we get enough money...many kids). Get your clubs involved. This project truly matters. Don't delay. Dakotah's life really does depend on it. Yours in Service, Tony Bernardo Executive Director CILA PS: Please send any donations to: The Dakotah Fund PO Box 44030, 600 Grandview St. S. Oshawa, ON L1H 8P4 or donate electronically on the CILA web site ps: We will issue Fund Updates on the Digest and on the CILA web site. http://www.cila.org Canadian Institute for Legislative Action / Institut Canadien pour l'Action Legislative National Office: P.O.Box 44030, 600 Grandview St. S. Oshawa, ON. L1H 8P4 Ph: (905) 571-2150 Fax: (905) 436-7721 e-mail: teebee@sprint.ca Ottawa Office: 27 Cedar Grove Crt. Nepean, ON. K2G 0M4 Ph: (613) 828-8805 Fax: (613) 828-6967 e-mail: aldorans@magma.ca Home: http://www.cila.org A proud member of the World Forum on the Future of Sport Shooting Activities / Forum du Monde sur le Futur d'Activites des Sports des Armes a Feu ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 Oct 1999 19:06:20 -0600 From: griffith@superaje.com Subject: Re: reregistration?? ** Reply to note from James Cox Fri, 22 Oct 1999 06:22:56 -0600 > I don't know how credible this is, but I'd like input...Someone > mentioned to me today that the re-registration of prohibited or > restricted firearms has been changed to 31 Nov 99. Sounds good to me. In fact, when 31 Nov. 99 gets here, I'm going to register all my guns. Gerald Griffith People are always blaming their circumstances for what they are. I don't believe in circumstances. The people who get on in this world are the people who get up and look for the circumstances that they want, and if they can't find them, make them. --George Bernard Shaw ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 Oct 1999 19:06:23 -0600 From: "Geren, Rick" Subject: Registration under Amnesty Anyone run into this problem? There is an amnesty until Nov 30, 1999 for the registation of restricted firearms. This gives me an opportunity to register a .22 pistol that I have in my possession. Dutifully following instructions, I filled in form JUS676E "Application to register a newly imported restricted firearm." All OK until I come upon instruction #17 that requires signature of an approved "firearms verifier." After numerous phone calls, I get hold of a verifier, but now I have to get a permit to transport the firearm to get it to his shop for verification. I call the Quebec Provincial Police, and they tell me that they DO NOT give permits to transport unregistered handguns. So now what? Subsequently I have made dozens of phone calls to the the Canadian FIrearms Center, the RCMP, the Provincial Police, and no one seems to know what to do in this situation. This is a real "Catch 22" or "Catch .22" in the case of firearms. Finally a coordinator at the firearms regsitry office in Montreal told me "not to worry about it ... send in your amnesty form; the firearm can be verified later." He says there is a special provision in the law that allow the issue of restricted firearm transportation permits for this situation. Should I believe him? Does anyone out there know about this special provision? or can elaborate some other solution to my problem. Rick ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 Oct 1999 19:06:26 -0600 From: Jim Davies Subject: lieberal thought for today A system of licensing and registration is the perfect device to deny gun ownership to the bourgeoisie." - Vladimir Ilyich Lenin ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 Oct 1999 19:06:29 -0600 From: Rick Lowe Subject: Buying Gun Stuff In The US Randy Nelson said: > A Canadian Citizen, I tried to purchase a new Marlin 1895G 45/70 while in > Michigan. Not a chance; ITARS at work I'm afraid. Without a BATF import/ > export permit, the only way you can secure said firearm is to have the US > vendor physically deliver it to Canadian Customs. (Kustoms for Peter). This may be nothing new and may have nothing to do with ITARS. When I was stationed in the Lower Mainland, many weekends were spent shopping at Ron Kesselring's store in Agar just south of Bellingham. This goes as far back as 1979 or so. Over the years, I purchased numerous firearms at Kesselrings. Ron always told me he couldn't sell to Canadians (and perhaps not even non Washington residents, I don't recall). Anyway, never thought much of it at the time because Ron faithfully made a trip once a week to the border where he handed the firearms over to the purchasers at Canada Customs. I guess the big difference now is that it would be illegal for a shop to export as Ron used to these days... ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 Oct 1999 19:06:33 -0600 From: Manny Masongsong Subject: Locations of Shooting Ranges in BC Does anyone out there have a list of the shooting ranges in the Lower Mainland, BC? I've probably been looking under the wrong headings, but I just could not find them in the telephone directory. If you could please, I would greatly appreciate your sending this list including the name of the club or range, specific location and address, whether they are rifles only or handguns also allowed, outdoors or indoors, number of stalls, maximum range (20, 50, 100, 200 yards, etc.), hours of operation and day fee for non-members. It would also help if you could add if there is ventilation if it is an indoor range. I enjoy shooting but am trying to avoid indoor ranges because of the potential harm due to lead dust. My favorite range, Barnet in Port Moody, has been closed for over a year now since that woman committed suicide there. I would greatly appreciate someone sending this information. Thank you. Manny Masongsong Delta, BC ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 Oct 1999 19:06:38 -0600 From: "T. Bryant" Subject: Re: Cdn-Firearms Digest V3 #188 Concerning the ads about spousal abuse we should all be angry at the format not only as firearms owners but as knowledgeable citizens that oppose discrimination at all levels. Earlier this year it came to light that the statistics that have been used by the government were skewed by hiding the statistics that showed that women were just as likely to physically abuse there spouses. The authors and the departments that used these reports chose not to tell people about the woman as abuser section of the report because it was "counter intuitive" as Wendy Cukier likes to say. Using this dishonest approach we have been sold a decade of discrimination against men as the abusers in a relationship. Million of our dollars have been used to sell this lie to the public. This stigma has been used to build a gender based guilt trip that has no basis in fact. We have endured years of discrimination based on a flawed report (sounds familiar eh?). Despite the revelation that anyone has the potential to be the abuser and/or the abused the myth of men as the sole abuser continues to be perpetuated by ads like this one. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 Oct 1999 19:06:45 -0600 From: "John Perocchio" Subject: Request for action Dear Digest, Over the last few days you've been kind enough to mention the spousal abuse ad campaign that is currently being run in Ontario (See Digest # 188). Here's an excerpt from my correspondence: ....It starts out with " do you know what this is .....the sound of and egg being beaten .... do you know what this is ... the sound of a drum being beaten .....etc. etc. then thuds and screaming .... the sound of a woman being beaten ........ here is how you beat a man ( the sounds of a touch tone phone ) dial ..... " Now for the part that really offends me: " if you know of a woman facing violence WHETHER FIREARMS ARE INVOLVED OR NOT call ...." I'm greatly concerned that this will subtly vilify firearms owners in the public's eye even more than our Liberal government's pathetic & ill-fated firearms legislation (Bill C-68). Why not the mention of fists, knives, baseball bats etc.? These seem to be the weapons of choice for cowards that beat women (& incidentally the other way around..but that's another argument); why key in on the obscure choice of firearms & create a slanted impression about firearms owners?... My correspondence with the local radio station has revealed that this ad was sponsored by the Government of Ontario among others and is currently playing across the province. I would ask that any subscribers who have heard this ad complain to the Ontario Government, their M.P.P. & the station playing the ad. Please let others know. I've listed a few e-mail addresses below that might be of immediate use in this endeavor. Premier Harris: webprem@gov.on.ca Attorney General Jim Flaherty: jim_flaherty@ontla.ola.org Solicitor General David Tsubouchi: dave_tsubouchi@ontla.ola.org - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Searched for women's directorate and came up with this hit: http://www.gov.on.ca/owd/ The minister responsible for the OWD is Helen Johns (she is the one who signed the "Minister's message"): THE HONOURABLE HELEN JOHNS MINISTER OF CITIZENSHIP, CULTURE AND RECREATION WITH RESPONSIBILITY FOR SENIORS AND WOMEN MPP FOR HURON-BRUCE: helen_johns@ontla.ola.org Government of Ontario (M.P.P. listing): http://www.gov.on.ca/ Please send a loud warning that the Firearms Community will not accept any less respect than others. Thanks, John Perocchio ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 Oct 1999 19:10:36 -0600 From: LCS Subject: Re: posting! Gordon : Yes! you miss read the posting. The related addys and phone numbers are I'm told, directed straight at the organizations who are fighting not only firearms registration but the whole Lie and Fraud that the CFA/CCC amendments are. The general registry, the whole people control act is an affront to all law abiding Canadians. As for being Lying Wendy's buddy that is laughable LOL LOL. Anyone that knows me and knows how long I have fought her and her like know what a misrepresentation that comment is. I and Herb Struff faced her off in Victoria when Liar Rock and his henchmen where there. The RFC held a rally on the lawn of the Hotel Complex to let them know what we thought of them. I was one of the people who went through the crowds spreading information sheets. After the rally we had an opportunity to totally stop one of Wendy's Spin Media Bites. Every time she opened her mouth either Herb or I stuck her foot in it. He stood on one side of her and I on the other. THAT IS WHAT I DO SIR ! As for being a tree hugger and an enemy of trappers that is absolutely hilarious. One of our NCS BC directors is, the past National & BC Provincial President of the Trappers Association. This type of communication is exactly what I referred to when I stated in my "Simon" response to McKay about lie's and innuendo. It will not stand, I stand with pride and honor behind what I have done for and in the RFC as did all of us in our organization. As for donations, well Sir. We do not sell T Shirts nor Jackets nor Badges nor do we solicit money from businesses then tell everyone how to get around using those businesses. All we ask is enough to keep the information flowing. To be able to respond to the real horror situations that are cropping up all over the country by providing a legal Care Service for anyone in the RFC to take advantage of. To interact with other national and international groups and individuals. Who are fighting the same thing in their homelands. As for matters related to "other issues" it is one and the same if you study the CFA/CCC amendments you would see that. I humbly suggest you do. The Truth Is Out There ! Research, Expose & Take it to the "People". Rod. Bugaresti NCS BC [ VP Communications - Prov. Coordinator ] Web site @ http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/Congress/9460/index.html MAC SOG [member/coordinator] , Related Web site @ http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Acres/5472/path.html BCCPD [Member/Activist] , CIA [member/contributor] , *New Phoenix Firearms Association----> "AKA - NFA" - *("original concept" Supporter). ------------------------------ End of Cdn-Firearms Digest V3 #189 ********************************** Submissions: mailto:cdn-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Mailing List Commands: mailto:majordomo@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Moderator's e-mail address: mailto:parry@ionline.net List owner: mailto:owner-cdn-firearms@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca FAQ list: http://www.magma.ca/~asd/cfd-faq1.html and http://teapot.usask.ca/cdn-firearms/Faq/cfd-faq1.html Web Site: http://teapot.usask.ca/cdn-firearms/homepage.html FTP Site: ftp://teapot.usask.ca/pub/cdn-firearms/ Digest Back-issues: by FTP (cd pub/cdn-firearms/Digests), or visit the Cdn-Firearms web site (above), or put the next command in a message and mailto:majordomo@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca get cdn-firearms-digest v03.n022 end (022 is the digest issue number and 03 is the volume) To unsubscribe from _all_ the lists, put the next five lines in a message and mailto:majordomo@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca unsubscribe cdn-firearms-digest unsubscribe cdn-firearms-alert unsubscribe cdn-firearms-chat unsubscribe cdn-firearms end (To subscribe, use "subscribe" instead of "unsubscribe".) 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